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3.8L Exhaust discussion

nice post RancherLee

I'm doing a huge SC oriented cam soon for a T-Bird guy,
it will have some good duration and huge lift, .599" on
the intake side :D

You can exceed the general guidelines but that
involves re-engineering the whole combo, as in
rear gearing, RPM range (intakes and heads, cams)
and nearly everything else. The only thing
I would change is exhaust system setup,
true duals of 2.25" works great but there
may be routing issues in a T-Bird, right?

How do you like your setup so far :)
 

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Just to answer your Q, a good exhasut shop should not have problems routing true dual up to 2.5 inches in any T-bird with a 93+ style (I think it's 93) gas tank. I hope that cam is gonna sound nice. I have never heard an SC with a nice sounding exhaust.

PJ
 

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is there really an advantage to true dual exhaust on a V6? I've got dual 2.25" into a single 3" on my car but I could have done dual 2.25" all the way back, there is room. I did all the cutting and welding on my exhaust when I built it. I'm kind of debating weather to change my exhaust setup when I get the Kook long tubes or just keep my single 3"

BTW: Welcome aboard RGR!
 

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It's hard to tell whether or not there is an advantage. I feel there are only a few factors that can alter exhaust velocity and volume (not db): pipe diameter, light angled bends, muffler style (chambered vs straight through) and scavenging. On the 3.8, I figure 2.25 is ideal whether it's true dual or into a single 3 inch. Once blown, 2.5 inch diameter could not hurt. It would be interesting to experiment with x-pipe locations for tuning since it is pretty much certain that an x-pipe location for a v8 won't be optimal for the v6. I have heard multiple theories on how to optimize that, but my reasoning comes from the fact that our banks fire completely isolated from eachother. First cyls 1-3 fire, then 4-6. It may be that an x-pipe does nothing for us. If that's the case (which I doubt) maybe true duals without a crossover or a merge would be the way to go.

PJ

PS-- Rancher, if you want this on a different thread, start it and I will move this over.
 

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Discussion Starter #5
I really need to experiment on this even-fire V6 exh. setup.
I have several ideas (which I can try once I get My'stang)
The firing is actually like this, 1-4, 2-5, 3-6, 1-4... etc. and
1 cycle takes 2 crank revolutions. the 1-2-3 is evenly spaced
as is the 4-5-6 so each side can have a conservatively sized
header collector and pipe to the cats. I have recommended
2.25" for most setups since it handles 300 BHP without a
restriction. Total flow is ~1160 CFM versus ~1030 for single 3"
so even a single 3" pipe is doing quite well! These are max
theoretical figures, there is gonna be a loss in the bends
and so forth, but both types have it so I just compare the
max possible flow #'s.
 

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ok this is more along the thread i was looking for.....i posted in the other one about your exhaust coment.....im not to sure but it just seems a little small 2" duals seems like it would only get to about 230whp-26whp...while 2.25 duals would get father and i doubt alot of backpresure would be lost....but its also the issues of the gas tanks i guess
 

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Discussion Starter #8
kewl, I'm on board

I'd say PJ could really use 2.5" duals NA if he really
gets serious with the setup. I'd like to see how a
v6 works with a Pro-Chamber or X pipe
(I hate "H" pipes now :zpuke: ) but in theory
the even fire 6 does not need it at all...

I'm theorizing on a type of resonator or something
in between the pipes that adds a little bit of "rasp"
or "growl" to the note, while not killing flow. It would
be a big seller if it made a more V8-like sound and
was a weld-in or bolt-on setup :D
 

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I still figuring out what to blame on my loss of low end torque. (head/camming or exhaust)
BONE stock with the 3.23 open rear diff and stock 2" single exhaust I was cutting 2.41-2.44 60ft's
Now with 3.73 posi, underdrive crank, Ported heads, intakes, cam, and my large 3" single exhaust the best 60ft to date is a 2.500 but I haven't been able to test it with the 3200rpm converter since I STILL haven't gotten my tranny from Pete.
 

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RGR, thanks for clarifying the firing order. There already is a muffler that you would love for your x-pipe application. I'm running true 2.5" duals from the kooks headers into the Edelbrock RPM performer muffler, which is a dual-in dual-out 2.5" muffler, which merges (Xes) inside. I'll try to find a pic and post it. I used to have just an X-pipe, and it sounded like crap. It was very raspy-- like a trumpet and sounded like a rice burner. It was definately the lack of a resonator in my case.

The current setup with the Edelbrock muffler out to dual 2.5s and terminated by dual magnaflows sounds SWEET. It has a very V8 gurgle at idle and driving through parking lots, but when you gun it, it sounds like nothing I have ever heard. It's a very tuned, determined scream. It's not ricey and it definately doesn't sound like a V8 or a boat.

Rancher, I don't know why you aren't seeing better 60 ft times. All I can say is that I expected a low-end loss with my 2.5" duals, but instead I was surprised with MUCH BETTER torque than I had with the stock single exhaust setup. I think it may have had something to do with the X-pipe.

PJ
 

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how much is that eldebrock muffler?
 

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My old setup:


The Edelbrock muffler:




I have another couple of pics I need to upload, but I need to wait until I retrieve my password for my web space...

PJ
 

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RGR said:
nice post RancherLee

I'm doing a huge SC oriented cam soon for a T-Bird guy,
it will have some good duration and huge lift, .599" on
the intake side :D

Is that me?

I have a true dual setup with 2.25" pipes, high flow cats, and glasspacks. I think it sounds awesome for a v6 and sure flows good. Can't wait tog et a cam and ported heads on.
-Thomas
 

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wow...looks kind of coo......it also looks really long?....whats the demensions on that beast?
 

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dayum......big thing.....so theres a place under the bird were it sit ok and has room around it?
 

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i wonder what some of the Edelbrock mufflers would sound like on v8s.....if it gives the v6 a nice growl it cant be bad for the V8s at all.....im liking these mufflers :D
 

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Discussion Starter #20
That's you Thomas!

I like this cam even more,
mondo lift and just right duration
for big supercoupe boost. We made
300 RWHP and 400 RWTq with a
similar intake duration on a 4.3
stroker and SC top end, and his
exhaust system is costing him lots
of HP and lots of things are mismatched.
(hard to get people to do the whole
combo sometimes :D) He only has
the .495/.520 lifts while yours is
.599/.560 so I see much more potential
in your setup with big boost.
BTW, the above combo on a 4.3
made all that power on only ~8-9# boost
so you are looking good with more :D
 
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