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Discussion Starter #21
OK, so the effort to do a reverse bleed didn't help. There is definitely something binding because the wheels don't really want to turn even with the car in neutral. I guess I'm pulling the transmission back out.

The bright side is that I can fix the collectors. :crying:
 

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On the good side, maybe the clutch/linkage is all ok.

Rebuilding those isn't too bad (manuals in general); I'd bet it's in the shift forks, like Matt had to redo.

If they're bent, you can be in two gears at the same time; I've had a bike do that.

It's better in a car; you don't crash instantly. :thumbsup:

Are there two levers on the tranny linkage?
I remember an old chevy work van that the linkage would get jacked, external to the tranny, and you could crawl out in the middle of the intersection and jam it back into place with a big screwdriver. :facepalm: (god, I hated that van; they would Not replace it.)

It hit like 2nd and third, going to second, or some such.

What I'm getting at is that it might be a linkage problem, and that might be fixable externally.
One fork moves, one doesn't.

Have you tried moving the rear wheels backwards, while someone jacks the linkage/shifter? That was also a thing.
If it suddenly frees up, you know what to looks for, for sure, before you pull it.

For the record, I know nothing about these particular transmissions.
 

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Discussion Starter #23
On the good side, maybe the clutch/linkage is all ok.

Rebuilding those isn't too bad (manuals in general); I'd bet it's in the shift forks, like Matt had to redo.

If they're bent, you can be in two gears at the same time; I've had a bike do that.

It's better in a car; you don't crash instantly. :thumbsup:

Are there two levers on the tranny linkage?
I remember an old chevy work van that the linkage would get jacked, external to the tranny, and you could crawl out in the middle of the intersection and jam it back into place with a big screwdriver. :facepalm: (god, I hated that van; they would Not replace it.)

It hit like 2nd and third, going to second, or some such.

What I'm getting at is that it might be a linkage problem, and that might be fixable externally.
One fork moves, one doesn't.

Have you tried moving the rear wheels backwards, while someone jacks the linkage/shifter? That was also a thing.
If it suddenly frees up, you know what to looks for, for sure, before you pull it.

For the record, I know nothing about these particular transmissions.
To my knowledge every thing is internal on these transmission. The car seems to shift just fine, it just won't disengage the clutch. Something is binding up and I'll need to separate the transmission from the engine to see what's up.
 

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Something is binding up and I'll need to separate the transmission from the engine to see what's up.
I read the thread you referenced, and a few of the others; from what they're saying it could be the input shaft binding up.

Dude said he dropped the DS, and pulled the tranny back on the mount, and it freed up. :(


I wonder if it shifted on the dowels while it was running before. :zdunno:

Didn't you have some issues with that clutch, going in? They mentioned the shoulder bolts, and that sounded familiar.
I can't seem to find your thread...

Ah crap; you'll find it.

I just hate that it's giving you this much crap after you've came so far.

Like you said tho, it gives you an opportunity to mess with the collectors. :)

I want to see this baby run; but not as much as you do, I bet. :)

Don't let it discourage you!



EDIT:

OK, afer reading that thread, and Reading your thread again, you and S4Gunn discussed the clutch bolts a bit.

Is it possible that this is the problem?

Things have been moving along slowly. Like so many things, I've had to wait for stuff to get lined up. The latest is that when I did the manual swap I was very paranoid that I didn't have the correct bolts for the pressure plate. The standard 5/16" bolts that ARP and FRPP lists for this combination didn't work in the cast iron flywheel and, even though the Fidanza flywheel had holes that the bolts fit, the holes in the Spec pressure plate didn't line up to those holes. The end result is that I bought a set of ARP bolts that were listed to fit a Pontiac pressure plate that are 3/8" x 1" and are shouldered like is specified. The worked perfectly. The blue Loctite is on all of the fasteners and the flywheel, clutch and pressure plate are all installed. The next step is to install the transmission and work from there. Now for finding more spare time.

I've added a couple of pictures for fun.






I found a similar issue when I went from a SC flywheel to a F150 M5R2 flywheel.
Every time I find something unique like this, I document it so I have a spreadsheet that shows exactly what bolts I need for a specific application and the torque spec.

My notes showed that I needed 7/16-20 x 1" for the PP to Flywheel bolts

F150 5.0 M5R2 Flywheel: 7/16-20 x 1" (Mr Gasket set #4698)
NOTE: Some flywheels use a 3/8-16 x 1"
35ft-LBs or 420in-lbs

Also, you're using the stock SC Master, I think; how does it relate to the one discussed in the previously linked thread? Is there enough volume to activate the internal slave, vs the external slave the SC has?

I'm not knowledgeable enough to say here, but this is something that was not totally "Issue Free" in your previous thread, and S4Gunn used a different flywheel, it seems to me.

In some of the threads I read, bolt shoulder size was one thing not letting go, and the other threads were the Master too small, and not letting go.

I'm just looking for stuff we might have missed; TheF150 guy said he needed a different master, but another thread didn't, so IDK.

The tranny sticking was mentioned from the beginning, so it's not something that suddenly happened, as I think I thought.

The Very last thing I can think of: Is this the same tranny from the wrecked car? Could it have gotten pounded to where it won't work, and is bent and or dragging?

If you pull it loose, you should be able to hit neutral, and turn it and see.

I'm sure you've been all thru this, but this is all I see remaining as an unknown.

Just trying to help! :smile2:
 

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I read the thread you referenced, and a few of the others; from what they're saying it could be the input shaft binding up.

Dude said he dropped the DS, and pulled the tranny back on the mount, and it freed up. :(


I wonder if it shifted on the dowels while it was running before. :zdunno:

Didn't you have some issues with that clutch, going in? They mentioned the shoulder bolts, and that sounded familiar.
I can't seem to find your thread...

Ah crap; you'll find it.

I just hate that it's giving you this much crap after you've came so far.

Like you said tho, it gives you an opportunity to mess with the collectors. :)

I want to see this baby run; but not as much as you do, I bet. :)

Don't let it discourage you!



EDIT:

OK, afer reading that thread, and Reading your thread again, you and S4Gunn discussed the clutch bolts a bit.

Is it possible that this is the problem?












Also, you're using the stock SC Master, I think; how does it relate to the one discussed in the previously linked thread? Is there enough volume to activate the internal slave, vs the external slave the SC has?

I'm not knowledgeable enough to say here, but this is something that was not totally "Issue Free" in your previous thread, and S4Gunn used a different flywheel, it seems to me.

In some of the threads I read, bolt shoulder size was one thing not letting go, and the other threads were the Master too small, and not letting go.

I'm just looking for stuff we might have missed; TheF150 guy said he needed a different master, but another thread didn't, so IDK.

The tranny sticking was mentioned from the beginning, so it's not something that suddenly happened, as I think I thought.

The Very last thing I can think of: Is this the same tranny from the wrecked car? Could it have gotten pounded to where it won't work, and is bent and or dragging?

If you pull it loose, you should be able to hit neutral, and turn it and see.

I'm sure you've been all thru this, but this is all I see remaining as an unknown.

Just trying to help! :smile2:
My setup was the following:
* SC clutch slave cylinder (inside the bellhousing; sits on the input shaft)
* SC clutch master
* Custom clutch line (extra long with disconnector in the middle instead of inside the bell housing)
* 95 F150 Flywheel, pressure plate, and Starter.
* I had to grind the opening in the SC scattershield a little wider to fit the raised lip on the F150 starter OR grind the lip off the starter. I did it one way until I fixed the plate itself.

Knock on wood but i never had any issues with this setup.
I did notice once when I picked up the F150 clutch slave that it was a bit too long (didn't fit on the SC M5R2 input shaft the same way as with the SC).


Q: Wasn't this the same clutch/transmission setup that was on the previous car before the accident? If so, I hope the input shaft on on Randy's M5R2 wasnt bent.

Also, how were you able to confirm that the clutch was moving in 1/2" (from the inspection port on the bellhousing)?
 

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Also, you're using the stock SC Master, I think; how does it relate to the one discussed in the previously linked thread? Is there enough volume to activate the internal slave, vs the external slave the SC has?
His is the exact same setup as the SC, there were never external slaves on them.
 

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I keep thinking of your thread, with the external slave. D'oh!

Seems like Vic made one too.

My bad.

The only difference I see between S4gunn's setup and this guy is the Fidanza flywheel, and the side impact. :(
 

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Ah, my external slave is from a Chevy :zwall:


I have doubts about the input shaft getting bent in the accident, I feel like there’d be very obvious signs of fatigue and damage if it were turned into a banana with the body, the mounts should have absorbed the brunt
 

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Discussion Starter #29
OK, lots of replies.

You've all nailed it in general. The transmission was in working order after the wreck since I drove it from the track to the tow truck. I also pulled it into the garage and out a few times.

The throwout bearing is definitely moving about 1/2" when pressing the clutch and I have verified that through the inspection window.

I'll just take it apart and see what I see.
 

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Which parts are new, Just the flywheel and physical clutch plates/cover?

Do you still have the old parts? That gives you something to compare to.

One of the threads I saw elsewhere said something about the pilot bushing being the wrong size; I doubt you changed it, iirc it's in the crank.


I might try one more thing (I'm nuts...); since the slave is above the master, there could be a bubble in there.

If you REALLY want to know before you take it apart, you could hit the slave with the compressor to see if it will release.

If it's an air bubble, 150psi should still operate the throwout, unless you put a monster spring in it, or it's mechanically stuck.

It Will have an air bubble after that, so it still has to come out; but you'd know what it is.

It might blow the seals out of the slave, so there's that issue; I don't think so, but it's possible.

I test auto clutches with air, is why I even suggest it.
Nothing like building an auto clutch, and finding out a lip is curled over inside; I did that on the first one.


If you have one of the handheld brake "power bleeders", you could use that, and not really risk getting an air bubble in there.
 
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Discussion Starter #31
Good news. I pulled the transmission and the problem was the bolts that I used. The shoulder on the bolt was too long which didn't allow the pressure plate to evenly seat. I put on thick washers and the problem is solved. The car is back together and I've verified that everything is working as it should.
 

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Let's see that fire eating dragon make some smoke.
 

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Good news. I pulled the transmission and the problem was the bolts that I used. The shoulder on the bolt was too long which didn't allow the pressure plate to evenly seat. I put on thick washers and the problem is solved. The car is back together and I've verified that everything is working as it should.
Nothing sucks more than to have everything together and you have to pull the trans or lift the engine out just to fix some issue like dropping something or the oil shaft into the oil pan. I've had to do that... twice. :)
 

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Discussion Starter #35
Nothing sucks more than to have everything together and you have to pull the trans or lift the engine out just to fix some issue like dropping something or the oil shaft into the oil pan. I've had to do that... twice. :)
Yeah, you know the struggle is real for sure. Considering the amount of real world experience I have with all of this, I'm actually surprised I've gotten this far without significant problems.
 
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