TCCoA Forums banner

1 - 20 of 30 Posts

·
Registered
Joined
·
218 Posts
Discussion Starter #1
Just ordered mine (part number 12468). I can't wait for it to get here and get it installed. I'm having the cats removed (no emissions here in IN), 2.5 piping from the manifolds into the resonator at the factory resonator/y pipe location, and straight back to the rear bumper where they will be turned down at the bumper. Estimated arrival time on the muffler is the 21st. The TCCoA community seems to be running short on exhaust clips these days. I'll be sure to grab a few clips when I get it done.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
218 Posts
Discussion Starter #2
UPDATE - Muffler came in last Thursday. I'm going tomorrow to have the exhaust shop look over the pictures of the bends he'll be making and hopefully I'll be able to get my car in on Thursday or Friday as long as his schedule is open and I can get my car running by then. The humidity is making me sick to my stomach.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
218 Posts
Discussion Starter #3
UPDATE - The work got done today. I haven't had a chance to get under the car to see how everything looks but from the few bends I could see it looks like they did a pretty good job. It definitely wasn't as loud as I was expecting it to be but I think it sounds good. Far better than the Flowmasters ever did. I'm whooped right now. I'll shoot some video tomorrow night after work and get them uploaded either shortly after or later at night.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
3,902 Posts
This is the muffler that we all use for mid-mounting right? I think its the same one I have and it sounds awesome with no cats and a single 3" tailpipe.
 

·
WOT Junkie and avid corn burner
Joined
·
3,734 Posts
How about that exhaust video/ sound clip? I want to know how good this sounds.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
218 Posts
Discussion Starter #6
Rob, this is a dual in dual out with built in x pipe.

Michael, it sounds great and I love it.I shot multiple videos but for some reason my camera didn't want to save them :/. Since there didn't seem to be much interest in this thread I decided to wait and let the packing break in. I've got maybe a couple hundred miles on the system now so ill see if my buddy can shoot some high quality video for me either this weekend or next.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
99 Posts
interesting thread, im also getting ready to do exhaust work and was considering the x-pipe, but is it worth a crap with the converters? i already cut off the pre cats but really it sounds like ass atm, raspy and loud like a old pick up.not the mustang type of sound i was shooting for lol
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
58 Posts
I was looking in to doing a true dual but wasn't sure if I cut off all the cats do you still need to use the o2 sensors anymore? Did a search but nothing really answered my question if I had all the cats cut off and installed a mid mount x-pipe and straight pipes to the rear do you still use any of the sensors. Being as I live in Florida we are not subject to inspections. Aslo would the car run corectly and or need a tune for that?
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
218 Posts
Discussion Starter #9
My buddy has a Mustang and he always calls me when he knows I'm driving by and says "Hey! You just drove by... cuz it sounded like a stock Mustang" If I were to do it over again I'd go with the shortest muffler case length in an attempt to make it even louder.

The O2s after the cats don't do anything so when I had the cats cut, I had them remove the rear O2s as well. No tune is really needed but you will have a CEL on all the time without them. The front O2s are still vital to the system though.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
5,417 Posts
My buddy has a Mustang and he always calls me when he knows I'm driving by and says "Hey! You just drove by... cuz it sounded like a stock Mustang" If I were to do it over again I'd go with the shortest muffler case length in an attempt to make it even louder.

The O2s after the cats don't do anything so when I had the cats cut, I had them remove the rear O2s as well. No tune is really needed but you will have a CEL on all the time without them. The front O2s are still vital to the system though.
Actually it's been proven that along with monitoring the catalytic converters efficiency it does something else as well. Pm guitarmaestro for details on what else they do before spreading misinformation.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
58 Posts
Thanks for the input guys. I just want to make sure I am not going mess anything up by cutting things off that are needed. I am looking for an inexspencesive but a correct way to do a true dual with out sacraficing power. Seems everyone has a different set up so just getting info to get an idea of how I would want to piece one up for me. Sorry for robbing on this thread...
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
3,902 Posts
I didnt know the downstreams were used for anything besides catalyst monitoring! Could someone shed some light on this?

The muffler I have (had on the last car, :() is the narrow 2.5" dual in, dual out with x. My brother has one thats DI/DO with 2.5" and a larger body on his Centurion w 5.8l.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
218 Posts
Discussion Starter #13
Pm guitarmaestro for details on what else they do before spreading misinformation.
Could someone shed some light on this?
My intent was not to spread misleading information. 9/10s of the information I have read on this site basically said that they are not needed and serve no important use. If someone has information that says otherwise I think it needs to be present in this thread as it's one of the most recent involving going cat-less.

EDIT - I PMed guitar maestro a link to this thread and asked him to share his knowledge.
 

·
Super Moderator
Joined
·
11,961 Posts
I've been trying to find the link to the site for over a year that describes how the rear O2s can function as a reality check on the front O2S in the same way the front O2s serve as a reality check on the maf. So I can't prove it yet, and even then it might not have been implemented into our eec's.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,253 Posts
I am not sure what the front and rear O2s do when you don't have any cats, but my car has them. The EEC was done by Jerry W and verified by Darrin that the rears are enabled, so they must do something besides a cat check.

It seems kind of strange to have front and rear O2s on straight pipes, but they are there and Jerry is the man. This is a custom exhaust so they were put in there for some reason, but don't ask me why. :)

 

·
Registered
Joined
·
58 Posts
I think I'm just gonna get some aftermarket cats and do the mid X and straight pipes to the rear and keep the O2's. They must be there for some purpose. If not anything else I will not be poluting our air and no stupid CEL. Thank you "dew the thunder" for the thread.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,253 Posts
The rear O2 thing got my curiosity so I cut an pasted a few things below. After some searching I found that the major function is a cat check, but it can figure into the fuel trim calculation.

Fuel trim refers to adjustments being made dynamically to the base fuel table to get the proper ratio of fuel to air. Short term fuel trim refers to adjustments being made in response to temporary conditions. Long term fuel trim is used to compensate for issues that seem to be present over a much longer period. Fuel trims are expressed in percentages; positive values indicate lean (add fuel) and negative values indicate rich (subtract fuel). Fuel trim banks refer to the cylinder banks in a V style engine. Cylinder #1 is always in bank 1. Fuel trim is generally calculated by using a wide set of data values, including front O2 sensors, intake air temperature/pressure (or the more elegent air mass sensor), engine (coolant) temp, anti-knock sensors, engine load, throttle position (and change in throttle position), and even battery voltage can effect fuel trim. Long term fuel trim generally should not exceed +- 10

The rear O2 has a mininumal part in the calculation in OBD-II, maybe none depending on the software. Jerry updated the software in my EEC to a later version when he reflashed it back in early 2002.

Rear Fuel Trim
The rear oxygen sensor, located after the catalyst, is used for fuel trim corrections on some OBD-II vehicles. By virtue of its location, the rear sensor is generally protected from high temperatures and much of the contamination that affects the front oxygen sensors. In addition, the rear sensor sees exhaust gases that are equilibrated – they have already been converted by the catalyst so that there is very little residual oxygen. This allows the rear sensor to respond to much smaller changes in exhaust gas oxygen content. In turn, it then possible for the rear sensor voltage to remain near the 0.45 volt switchpoint. This characteristic allows the rear sensor to be used for fuel control. Under steady rpm and load conditions, the short term fuel trim bias can be adjusted so that the rear sensor voltage is maintained near the 0.45 volt switchpoint. This ensures that the catalyst is getting a stoichiometric exhaust gas mixture, despite any shift in the front sensor switchpoint. The rear fuel trim corrections are learned in KAM. Internally, this system is known as Fore Aft Oxygen Sensor Control (FAOSC). Note that FAOSC learns and reacts very slowly because the catalyst, with its large/slow oxygen storage and release characteristic, is part of the control loop. Also, this system cannot be used with a “y-pipe” exhaust where a single rear sensor would try to adjust dual front sensors.

There is a TSB also on O2 sensors: http://v8sho.com/SHO/TSB0197HO2SServiceTips.htm
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
218 Posts
Discussion Starter #18
Thank you GM and Dusty for chiming in. Like I stated before, I do not want to be the source of any misleading information.

That being said, I will try my best to have a couple videos of the exhaust up by the end of the long weekend. I am hoping for enough free time to do so. Thanks for being so patient everyone!
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,253 Posts
Don't worry about it. Most people including techs say the rears are just a cat check. The only reason I was wondering is that my car had both without cats.

At the end of the day it probably does not matter much.

We kind of diverged on your thread. I would imagine your exhaust is pretty loud?

I have a Magnaflow reasonator in the front like you, but it goes into a single 3" outlet and splits into two Magnaflow mufflers in the rear. It is pretty quiet at idle, put pretty loud under acceleration.

Look forward to hearing your clip. I guess I should do one one day.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
218 Posts
Discussion Starter #20
The shop that did mine actually offered to put bungs in the pipes for the rears but it was like an extra 100 in labor and they said one of the rears was broken. Obviously I opted away from that. I still don't think they matter but thats just my opinion. My car is running ten times better than it was before, but then again, its late enough in the year that if I break something I won't care because its getting put up soon.

Mine is somewhat loud and aggressive. I'd prefer it to be a touch louder which is why I am kinda regretting not going with a shorter case design. They still have a 14" and an 11" below my 18". I've still only got a few hundred miles on the system but I run my car hard so I'm hoping the muffler is about all the way broken in. Seems to get louder every other time I drive it.

All I know for sure is that I would NEVER recommend to any 4.6 owner to run a Flowmaster system. That's what I pulled off my car and I hated it since the day I got the car.
 
1 - 20 of 30 Posts
Top