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This is a nice thread; good editing. :)

I think I'll get one of these for the engine I'm eternally building.

I've already bought/made the engine pressurizer/pesticide sprayer to pressurize an engine before starting; building one in just makes sense now.

@rustonracing; Our main bearings aren't near as sensitive as cam bearings on these cars, and those are hard to impossible to fix. You Can buy new lower engine bearings. :)
 

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For me Purolator is the best economical decision, while yes there are better filter, I look at it this way its cheaper than Fram and had better components.

And on a 3.8 it would be impossible for them to drain back. :)
 

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Discussion Starter #23
Dug into them today










The outer cap is very brittle around the edges.

 

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Here's the buzz kill.
So why does my walmart, Fram, purator, insert any
Cheap filter always dump a filter full of oil the frame,
My arm and the ground with each oil change.

Oil , all filters, anti freeze and most other automotive
products are hype.
To get the masses to buy them.
Possible explanation:

The filters in question do not have an ADBV.
Oil is spilling out the center outlet hole.
The ADBV /spring are defective.

Notice in the first posted cut up photo of the MotorCraft filter. It has an ADBV. But the spring that holds everything together, and when no oil pressure is presents allows the flap of ADBV to close the inlet holes, is nothing more than that bent piece of rectangular metal. That's the spring. This type of spring is inferior to a coil spring, and will lose it's stored/kinetic energy to preform its given task in a shorter period of time than a coil spring. Hence, oil will spill out of the old used filter when you remove it from the engine.

The filter element has become so distorted it prevents the ADBV/spring to close the holes.
The filter is a counterfeit part.
I am in fact a fool, and being sucker punched by corporate marketing.

Now I want to take a brand new filter with an ADBV, and carefully pour oil only into the inlet holes. Hold my finger over the center outlet hole, and turn the filter upside down, and see what happens. ;)

Grog6 said:
Our main bearings aren't near as sensitive as cam bearings on these cars, and those are hard to impossible to fix. You Can buy new lower engine bearings.
That's good to know. I understand. The reason I wrote "main bearings" is because the liner path of the oil is from the filter to the main bearings first. Then the big end bore of the connecting rods, and then onward and upward.

ThunderChecken said:
Dug into them today
Outstanding photos. Thanks for posting them.

Wonder how one of those Golds would look...
 

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I always get oil out the center section of the filter and whatever's up above the filter in the block. Once that's drained out, what's left in the filter (between the filter and the case - the stuff that hasn't been filtered yet) doesn't come out.

I always loosen the filter, let the oil drain out slowly, then remove it. There's always a good amount of oil still left in the filter.
 

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The Parts Guy
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Man, you summed up in four words, and a photo what I jammered on about for six paragraphs!
That system looks freckin' nice.

Is that a schrader valve to charge the accumulator with compressed air?
Thanks. Yep, that is a Schrader valve on the end of the accumulator next to the pressure gauge. It's just there to put the initial charge on the back side of the accumulator piston on a brand new or freshly reassembled accumulator. I haven't added any air to it since the last time I had it apart seven years ago.



that reminds me, I need to buy the Canton Accusump setup as well. Is this the one that you are running?
That one is Moroso p/n 23901 with their 23905 solenoid valve, which is nothing more than a Goyen p/n 12QA2-DCA/2628 valve re-branded as Moroso.

@rustonracing; Our main bearings aren't near as sensitive as cam bearings on these cars, and those are hard to impossible to fix. You Can buy new lower engine bearings. :)
You can buy cam bearings, too. Installation just requires way more work (machining) than slapping in a set of main or rod bearings.
 

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Discussion Starter #27
Thought I would pass this along, Word is that the MC's have a issue that is called "Popper's" were the end cap metal does not adhere to the media base correctly. This one did not "Pop" off but took a flick of a finger for it too.

Take it for what its worth too you that use them. Don't flame me ;) News to me I have never heard of it .
 

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...That's good to know. I understand. The reason I wrote "main bearings" is because the liner path of the oil is from the filter to the main bearings first. Then the big end bore of the connecting rods, and then onward and upward.
I'd hate to know what some of these guys have in head parts. :)

I've recently read of a problem with oil pressure in the later PI engines; mostly 5.4s with the plastic tensioner bodies.
The tensioners apparently leak like a sieve, and drop the oil pressure above them to a point the valve train rattles like a diesel.
Ford has now swapped back to the original design, apparently. :)
 

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Here's the buzz kill.
So why does my walmart, Fram, purator, insert any
Cheap filter always dump a filter full of oil the frame,
My arm and the ground with each oil change.

Oil , all filters, anti freeze and most other automotive
products are hype.
To get the masses to buy them.
For the first - there's STILL a big hole in the middle, with the threads.

I don't know why you're so clumsy, I don't have that problem at all with my Dakota and just minimally with the Cougar with the 5.0HO ... :diablo:

As to the latter - Sure it's all hype. Don't put any oil in your motor, don't put any filters on it, put it outside with just water as coolant in 0F weather, and start it up and see how long it runs ...

Yes, there's a lot of snake oil. But not ALL filters are hype.

That's one thing going in this forum - seeing how they're made inside.

RwP
 

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That one is Moroso p/n 23901 with their 23905 solenoid valve, which is nothing more than a Goyen p/n 12QA2-DCA/2628 valve re-branded as Moroso.
Nice unit, but at only 1.5qts it won't do for me. I'm going with the 3qt accusump afterall. If I loose oiling at 7000+ RPMs, I need to make sure my very unique valvetrain stays together and my lower cam bearings don't get ruined. :)
 

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My previous car was a 2004 Grand Marquis with a PI 4.6. Not long after bought it in 2011, I was in a hurry and took it to Wally World for an oil change. After that, every time I started it up, I heard a noise I would have described as the lifters clattering on a pushrod motor. When I popped the hood to investigate, there was the bright orange Fram filter. I pulled it out and replaced it with a Motorcraft, and the lifter noise was gone.

Now whether or not that noise is causing any engine wear, I don't know.

When I was in college, I had a 1995 T-Bird with a 4.6 that had 135,000 miles on it when I bought it. I was always late with oil changes, it would burn oil and the level would drop until the oil pressure flatlined for a second going around corners, I'd run too high of a viscosity in her (I didn't know any better at the time)...I did all kinds of mean things to that poor little 4.6, and when I sold that car with 235,000 miles on her five years later, the engine still ran just as strong as the day she rolled off the showroom floor. Killing a 4.6L motor is kinda hard to do. That's why I've bought 3 more cars with that same model engine since I got rid of the first T-Bird.
 

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Discussion Starter #32
Purolater Classic L24651 Cut open

No busted pleats or loose end-caps.






 

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i actually cant run anything but motorcraft or purolator (which Ive herd makes motorcraft) on my car. she knocks like hell even on WIX. and even with the motorcraft if she sits over the weekend i get a few seconds of knocking on monday morning.

drained and changed quite a few Frams on engines at wallyworld that were completely dry when i removed them after sitting a couple min. camery 2200 engines come to mind because of the filter being mounted facing down. you can take them off the motor after a half hour without a drop running down the block >.>

Ive cut enough Frams open too know their horribly cheep, made of nothing but cellulose and glue, no backflow, or bypass valves...

i installed enough frams to know they had problems with threads on around 1% of the filters we got in bulk. we even had a box of them that kept blowing off the cars because the threads weren't tapped properly...

only thing they have going for them is the sandpaper coating on the outside for grip.

otherwise save your motor and buy something with more folds of filter media preferably in some material better then cardboard, make sure it has the drainback and bypass valves and you should be ok.
 

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ThunderChecken said:
Purolater Classic L24651 Cut open

Is that black rubber ring an anti-drain back valve, or does that filter not have one?

nail one said:
i get a few seconds of knocking on monday morning.
My completely stock 4.6 Romeo engine will knock (main bearing(s)) for about 2-3 seconds right when it starts up sometimes after an oil change, or if it sits for a number of days. Doesn't do it every time after an oil change, or after it has been sitting. Just every once in a while.

I use the MotorCraft filter, and it has always done this (once in a while) ever since I've owned it. I've put about 85k on the engine. Thinking of giving the NAPA Gold (WIX) filter a try. Hoping maybe it will stop the knock after the cars been sitting a while, but it wouldn't make any difference after an oil change. The only way to eliminate the knock, other than a rebuild/replacement, would be to install a remote filter, and a pre-oiling system.
 

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Discussion Starter #35 (Edited)
Yes it should have the black seal sets on top of it.This one has 83 pleats as well the most I have seen so far.
 

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My completely stock 4.6 Romeo engine will knock (main bearing(s)) for about 2-3 seconds right when it starts up sometimes after an oil change, or if it sits for a number of days. Doesn't do it every time after an oil change, or after it has been sitting. Just every once in a while.

I use the MotorCraft filter, and it has always done this (once in a while) ever since I've owned it. I've put about 85k on the engine. Thinking of giving the NAPA Gold (WIX) filter a try. Hoping maybe it will stop the knock after the cars been sitting a while, but it wouldn't make any difference after an oil change. The only way to eliminate the knock, other than a rebuild/replacement, would be to install a remote filter, and a pre-oiling system.
In those instances when the car has been sitting dormant or you've just done an oil change, you can use the "clear flood mode" to circulate some oil before firing the engine. Press the throttle ALL the way open, turn the key to the "START" position, let the engine crank for a few seconds, release the key, then release the throttle. After that, just start the engine normally. Clear flood mode shuts off the injectors and allows you to crank the engine without introducing any fuel.
 

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yep, that's what i do when i change my oil, works great.

and my filter relocation helped a bit, but i'm sure most of the difference is that i mounted my filters vertical instead of horizontal like on the engine was. at least i can now prime my filters. for the most part my knocks are gone, but like i said, when she sits a while over the weekend if you dont crank it a bit beforehand their will be a split second noise.

pretty sure the damage was done, when i got her their was a ACdelco filter on.... knocked right their on the dealership lot for like 10 seconds. these people knew i was coming and im not about to think they weren't smart enough to send someone out to start her beforehand. the motor was slightly warm already.

who knows what the original owner was running for the first 118k but since their is a knock, most likely frams or whatever cheep junk came at the local jiffylube.

i know she was PACKED with sludge. i didn't remove the valve covers, but i could see it thought the fill cap, and the first Mobil1 change i performed burned horribly and drained like brown chunky dek-a-cake icing... only took 4 quarts too, which was worrying. :D changed the filter at 500 miles and it was packed with turds. had to add 2 quarts at 1500, changed it all at 2k for some syn blend. next couple oil changes were still pretty filthy, but shes spotless nowadays and takes a good healthy 7 quarts.

oh and one thing i was going to mention about frams was those ecotec chevy engines with the internal filters. i used to see those completely collapsed into the filter cap constantly. and i noticed they are slightly taller then the OE ACdelco filters for the engine so when you tighten down the cap it crushes the pleats slightly.
 

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ThunderChecken said:
Yes it should have the black seal sets on top of it.This one has 83 pleats as well the most I have seen so far.
So what'ya think? Which is the better filter. Purolator, or the MotorCraft?


In those instances when the car has been sitting dormant or you've just done an oil change, you can use the "clear flood mode" to circulate some oil before firing the engine. Press the throttle ALL the way open, turn the key to the "START" position, let the engine crank for a few seconds, release the key, then release the throttle. After that, just start the engine normally. Clear flood mode shuts off the injectors and allows you to crank the engine without introducing any fuel.
That's a good idea. I never thought of using the clear flood mode. I have removed the fuel pump fuse, and cranked the engine. When I did it still knocked a little. Maybe I didn't crank it long enough.

Pressing the throttle to the floor is simple. And simple is usually a good thing.

Thanks for the advice.
 

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Discussion Starter #39
Imo Purolator more pleats . But the MC seams to have a better ADBV.
 

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Imo Purolator more pleats . But the MC seams to have a better ADBV.
That's what I was thinking too.

#1) IMO, the Amsoil filter is the best. With its synthetic filter media, coil spring, silicone ADBV, by pass valve, and beefy canister construction. Their products are designed, and manufactured specifically for high performance applications. I have used Amsoil synthetic engine oil since the late 70's. You can be sure that if, and when, I ever build another hi-po car, there will be no compromise.

#2,) The Wix filter like the Napa Gold.

#3.) The Purolator. More pleats, giving more filtering surface area. A no nonsense filter element construction. And, it does have an ADBV.

#4.) A close fourth to the Purolator is the MotorCraft.

And this is what will happen if you change his oil, and use a Fram filter...


 
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