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I hatter hijack a thread, but since it's already been done, I'll continue. IMHO Fantomworks is/was about the worst automotive show out there. The only worse show is Rust Valley Restorers. I won't even mention the Sunday morning shows. Those are in whole class of "awful" by themselves.
 
I hatter hijack a thread, but since it's already been done, I'll continue. IMHO Fantomworks is/was about the worst automotive show out there. The only worse show is Rust Valley Restorers. I won't even mention the Sunday morning shows. Those are in whole class of "awful" by themselves.
Awful how, if you don't mind my asking? I'm no expert in car restorations or running an auto shop but I've known a few mechanics who own their own shops, one that is big enough to do a decent show if they wanted, and what I see going on in Fantomworks is more or less what I've seen. Not to that show-winning level of restorations or trying to fix something very old and rare, but otherwise, ya.

The Tony Angelo side of things is more like what I think knowledgeable guys with tools and not that much patience would tend to do, cutting a few corners or trying something clumsier in order to get the thing finished, not worrying about authentic fasteners or parts. I like both approaches, I'm just not a fan of fake drama or watching the mechanics' personal lives, I don't care about that crap. That's where I lose interest in some of those shows trying to be funny or "interesting" when it's the cars that are interesting, not them.
 
Wait, nobody is a fan of "faster with finnegan"? The show where they show you how to ruin a car and make it worse all while spending money.

Tony is probably my least favorite host besides mike, i do like his offshoot stuff more but he is a bit too hacky. Was definitely cringing when i seen what they were doing with the exhaust and cutting the hole in the floor. I like tf outta lucky, freiburger and dulcich. I think roadkill garage is easily the more realistic show with a good insight into doing it in the real world. That is until david starts working on his own stuff with the water cooled credit cards lol. Still trying to get a line on the hotrod garage chick, at first i thought she was a spoiled "car girl with assets" but she definitely seems to at least be able to out weld all of them.

As most of you guys have touched on, the hard part is making things better without compromising too much. Problem with that is it takes way too much time and research to make it work with a tv show, though we do see it some with freiburger in roadkill garage with the more invest cars like the front LCA's on disgustang. Also, there is the "builders" own ideology to contend with.

Some things about it irritate me, but on the whole i like wheeler dealers, the older ones were a lot more authentic, as far as not leaving stuff out. They do a lot more to them than what they show and what they list on the "costs" sheet.
 
Wait, nobody is a fan of "faster with finnegan"? The show where they show you how to ruin a car and make it worse all while spending money.

Tony is probably my least favorite host besides mike, i do like his offshoot stuff more but he is a bit too hacky. Was definitely cringing when i seen what they were doing with the exhaust and cutting the hole in the floor. I like tf outta lucky, freiburger and dulcich. I think roadkill garage is easily the more realistic show with a good insight into doing it in the real world. That is until david starts working on his own stuff with the water cooled credit cards lol. Still trying to get a line on the hotrod garage chick, at first i thought she was a spoiled "car girl with assets" but she definitely seems to at least be able to out weld all of them.

As most of you guys have touched on, the hard part is making things better without compromising too much. Problem with that is it takes way too much time and research to make it work with a tv show, though we do see it some with freiburger in roadkill garage with the more invest cars like the front LCA's on disgustang. Also, there is the "builders" own ideology to contend with.

Some things about it irritate me, but on the whole i like wheeler dealers, the older ones were a lot more authentic, as far as not leaving stuff out. They do a lot more to them than what they show and what they list on the "costs" sheet.
Finnegan’s garage is way better than Faster with Finnegan, though you get a lot of exposure to Mike’s water cooled credit cards on it as well.

I’m going to sound way sexist but I still believe the new hot rod garage chick is a two for one diversity hire/eye candy for the mostly male audience. Yes, she’s a capable driver and builder because she closely grew up with it. She’s also very young and hot, think a dude that age with the same background/skills had any chance at that gig? Or that she’d get it if she were a frumpy and middle aged like the rest of the male hosts? Case in point the literal minute Discovery communications took over they instafired Elana Scherr, the only one besides Lucky of anyone that actually daily drives her old cars to work(Freiberger, Finnegan, and Dulcich IRL daily drive late model vehicles). For me it’s just so inorganic, same reason literally every iteration of Top Gear that doesn’t have Clarkson/Hammond/May sucks, the audience shouldn’t have to wait and see the chemistry between hosts form, it should already be there from the start, not a people selected by a corporate committee to meet a list of requirements that favor ratings.
 
...the new hot rod garage chick is a two for one diversity hire/eye candy for the mostly male audience... She’s also very young and hot...
Nailed exactly what i was thinking, not that im complaining really. Her and lucky seem to like eachother even if they dont really see eye to eye. I didnt know finnegan had another show. Also, that is why i like lucky so much and have wondered in the past how he got the gig, an actual mechanic that drives what he works on?
 
Wait, nobody is a fan of "faster with finnegan"? The show where they show you how to ruin a car and make it worse all while spending money.
Hahaha, ya, not really a fan. I mean, I like the humor and the stupid ideas, but that's one of those shows that seems like they build in failures so that they can have something to deal with later, "forgetting" to deal with something that ends up breaking later. And I don't like it when they butcher real cars, nice cars, even if the specific cars are rusty or in bad shape. If you want to screw around on race tracks or creating new abominations, limit the horror to worthless cars like Chrysler K cars or something else nobody wants.

Tony is probably my least favorite host besides mike, i do like his offshoot stuff more but he is a bit too hacky. Was definitely cringing when i seen what they were doing with the exhaust and cutting the hole in the floor. I like tf outta lucky, freiburger and dulcich. I think roadkill garage is easily the more realistic show with a good insight into doing it in the real world. That is until david starts working on his own stuff with the water cooled credit cards lol. Still trying to get a line on the hotrod garage chick, at first i thought she was a spoiled "car girl with assets" but she definitely seems to at least be able to out weld all of them.
What I don't like about Roadkill is that everything is left incomplete. I understand and sort of agree with the philosophy of just get the car moving, don't let it sit for years and years because you're trying to get it perfect, get it running first. Ok, but then they almost never do a "part 2" where they deal with everything else wrong with the car, like the interior (or lack thereof) or bodywork/paint. Ya, it's nice to get it running, but finish the job. And it's obvious what the difference is because something like Lucky's Chevelle looks great but is still, apparently, "almost" finished? Ya, it takes a while to nail down everything, not just getting it running.

As most of you guys have touched on, the hard part is making things better without compromising too much. Problem with that is it takes way too much time and research to make it work with a tv show, though we do see it some with freiburger in roadkill garage with the more invest cars like the front LCA's on disgustang. Also, there is the "builders" own ideology to contend with.
Agreed. I prefer seeing "what if" cars, like what if Ford/Chevy whatever had sold this version of car X? Sort of like a hand-built COPO car or something. That's what I (and I think many others here) am trying to do with my Thunderbird, make the "GT" version with Mustang brakes/hubs and J-Mod transmission and better suspension and (eventually) ported heads, make the muscle car version of the Thunderbird like it should have been from the beginning. Instead of the SC because I'm not a fan of turbo V6s. Some car TV shows do that, make "sleepers" or focus on the 1 or 2 limitations of a specific model and right those wrongs. I think Detroit Muscle used to be good at that though sometimes they go too far.

And for the sake of fuuuck, if I see another LS swap into an older car I'm going to stab something. I just watched an episode of Iron Resurrection (great show, like the people on the show and most of the mods done) and they're working on a '65 Buick Riviera. Buick, dammit. So of course, get a new custom frame and... LS Chevy motor + overdrive automatic. If I worked at that shop I'd threaten to quit if they did another LS, I would beg to be put in charge of the engine so I could hop it up with modern parts, aluminum heads, MSD DIS ignition, fuel injection, etc. but keep it a Buick. It's not a dragster, anyway, so it was never going to be the fastest anything, just needed to be faster than before to go along with the body and interior mods.

Some things about it irritate me, but on the whole i like wheeler dealers, the older ones were a lot more authentic, as far as not leaving stuff out. They do a lot more to them than what they show and what they list on the "costs" sheet.
Yes, apparently when the show got bought up by Motortrend or whatever the company before that was, they cut the budget. So, less time to do cool stuff and show it. It's still pretty decent in terms of getting older cars back to correct. Flipping Bangers is the cheapshit version of that, lots of unfinished business left to be done but the cars are complete and worth the 1,000-2,500 pounds price, just still tired and in need of eventual fixing because they didn't address anything that wasn't critical or dangerous.
 
Buick specifically i can see sorta because parts are hard to find and expensive, if you can even get aftermarket stuff. I have a 65 Wildcat that id like to do something with (think dax shepards continental) but youre so limited with the nailhead which is NOT going anywhere, way too cool and too much history.

VGG guy is good about fixing stuff on the real. The tempest or whatever he bought with the OHC 6 is cool as hell, so glad he didnt swap it. He seems to have about the same eclectic taste in vehicles as i do, although he likes chevys way too much. I dont really watch many of the shows besides the roadkill spinoffs, engine masters, HRG, and VGG. Will watch engine power or w/ever tf its called once in a while, they just did a sleeper granada with a 500whp 302 on the bottle thats pretty dope, cant stand the co-host guy tho.

Part of the reason i think roadkill-esque shows avoid finishing stuff is thats where people run into conflicting design ideas. Also, theres no shortage of shows out there that cover that stuff. Everything from your socks with sandals beige vinyl with billit accent everything, to concours restos. Those shows dont show the fun nitty gritty parts of getting an abandoned and molested beater back to running / driving.
 
What I don't like about Roadkill is that everything is left incomplete. I understand and sort of agree with the philosophy of just get the car moving, don't let it sit for years and years because you're trying to get it perfect, get it running first. Ok, but then they almost never do a "part 2" where they deal with everything else wrong with the car, like the interior (or lack thereof) or bodywork/paint. Ya, it's nice to get it running, but finish the job. And it's obvious what the difference is because something like Lucky's Chevelle looks great but is still, apparently, "almost" finished? Ya, it takes a while to nail down everything, not just getting it running.
Lucky daily drives that Chevelle to his shop, so It’s about as “unfinished” as my car is. eg, it’s never finished.

I haven’t watched many recent episodes of Roadkill but the best episodes always tended to be cars Freiberger or Finnegan cared about, and those would usually come back, if not on the main show Roadkill garage. First few seasons of roadkill was a breath of fresh air; just get your fantasy car, in whatever state you can get it, get it running and have fun. General Mayhem in with the original motorhome 440 was to me the coolest 68-70 Chargers in media I had ever seen, as is. Just an ex-parts car shell thrown together with swap meet parts and hooned around dirtfish, when most TV shows at best do a burnout a block away from the shop they meticulously built it. The “build” was hacking away the engine from a disgusting old RV with the transplant done in an outdoor residential car port. I never saw a car TV show episode I related to more than that one, no shop, no 4 post lift, no crate engines, no drama. So many TV builds build muscle cars into giant faberge eggs, Roadkill and VGG are the antithesis of that.

That said, I fell off because A. It’s not on YouTube anymore and B. The episodes got too simple, they either build a car you never see again, or they road-trip a car they barely threw together, never both anymore. Both I suspect a result of discovery trying to turn a YouTube show into a TV show. I suspect Vice Grip garage will suffer the same fate, the TV version episode I saw added unnecessary production value(multiple camera angles) and heavy handed editing. I don’t know why these shows need drone shots.

Nailed exactly what i was thinking, not that im complaining really. Her and lucky seem to like eachother even if they dont really see eye to eye. I didnt know finnegan had another show. Also, that is why i like lucky so much and have wondered in the past how he got the gig, an actual mechanic that drives what he works on?
I think so, I don’t know his full background but he has a shop near the motortrend/hot rod offices, so he may have brought in on magazine projects in the past. I think I remember hearing he was one of the mechanics that built cars on early episodes of overhaulin’.
 
Buick specifically i can see sorta because parts are hard to find and expensive, if you can even get aftermarket stuff. I have a 65 Wildcat that id like to do something with (think dax shepards continental) but youre so limited with the nailhead which is NOT going anywhere, way too cool and too much history.
Well, ya, a nailhead might be asking too much, nostalgia or not. In that case I'd get the more modern 455 type engine (though not necessarily that big) and upgrade that (with an overdrive transmission). But no LS, please, not again. TA Performance has many parts for the more modern Buick though I'm sure that prices would be higher than for Chevy versions. But so what, do something different! We already know that LS engines work and are reliable and are easy performance, we don't need another dozen car conversions to sell that idea. It makes me think of those NASCAR years where the driver is driving an "Oldsmobile" or a "Pontiac" but they're all tube-frame cars with Chevy motors underneath. I'm even starting to get tired of Gen III Hemis in every old Mopar, too.

VGG guy is good about fixing stuff on the real. The tempest or whatever he bought with the OHC 6 is cool as hell, so glad he didnt swap it. He seems to have about the same eclectic taste in vehicles as i do, although he likes chevys way too much. I dont really watch many of the shows besides the roadkill spinoffs, engine masters, HRG, and VGG. Will watch engine power or w/ever tf its called once in a while, they just did a sleeper granada with a 500whp 302 on the bottle thats pretty dope, cant stand the co-host guy tho.
I've started getting into Vice Grip Garage (and the Roadworthy Rescues version on MotorTrend), I like the oddball cars he decides to revive. He's funny as well. But again, some of those things are just rolling rust, I'd love to see him do a Part 2 where he gets them beyond just functioning to actually driveable by regular people.

There's Engine Power (mostly just engines) and Detroit Muscle (car projects that usually use a motor built by the Engine Power guys), along with a couple other shows I don't really watch. The Detroit Muscle guys are at least more willing to stick with the original engine family of the car being worked on, though they have done a few LS/Gen III Hemi/Coyote swaps.

I would include Garage Squad as a good middle ground. They get usually projects or abandoned family cars to practically complete and ready to drive daily condition. They may skimp on body repairs or paint because that's not the focus (beyond making them safe and no longer eyesores), it's mostly drivetrain and suspension (and interior). And usually some performance improvements (disc brakes, headers/limited-slip rear maybe, dual exhaust, better wheels, etc.) to go along with the rejuvenation.

Part of the reason i think roadkill-esque shows avoid finishing stuff is thats where people run into conflicting design ideas. Also, theres no shortage of shows out there that cover that stuff. Everything from your socks with sandals beige vinyl with billit accent everything, to concours restos. Those shows dont show the fun nitty gritty parts of getting an abandoned and molested beater back to running / driving.
True, but running ain't driving. Running means it moves without breaking down, driving means you can use it to drive to work (at least for me) with normal expectations of comfort and functionality (gauges work, heater/air works, no leaks, stereo works if it exists, doesn't smell like wet dog). Some of those Roadkill cars are useless except for beating them unmerciful on a racetrack.

I do also like watching shows like Hand Built Hot Rods (Steve Strope) but those are 2-year projects that are shown at SEMA that only celebrities and CEOs can afford. Still great to see the subtle design mods they do, things that you wish the auto companies would have done. That Nova with the '69 Camaro body lines looked amazing, and stock in badass way.

I think Tony Angelo is too focused on making cars that can compete on racetracks and in rally races (or drifting) no matter what was originally called for. He's sometimes too eager to rip out functioning parts of a car like the air-conditioning or the back seat. His YouTube show seems to be a little less racer, maybe because the cars are mostly his own so he doesn't want to butcher them as much. But on Hot Rod Garage I remember they did do a Javelin where he and Lucky actually built up an AMC V8, along with going over oiling mods to improve longevity, that was very cool. Made some solid power. Most shows, that would have been a Hemi swap.
 
Well, ya, a nailhead might be asking too much, nostalgia or not. In that case I'd get the more modern 455 type engine (though not necessarily that big) and upgrade that (with an overdrive transmission).
--------------
I've started getting into Vice Grip Garage (and the Roadworthy Rescues version on MotorTrend), I like the oddball cars he decides to revive. He's funny as well. But again, some of those things are just rolling rust, I'd love to see him do a Part 2 where he gets them beyond just functioning to actually driveable by regular people.
I know most would put a rocket in there or even 454, but i really dig nailheads. Going to keep the 401, hoping to someday find a super-wildcat intake for less than a kidney and firstborn; put a yuuuuuge cam in and sleeper tf outta the thing. Doesnt have the potential of a big block, but will be cool for what it is, and they can make respectable power which is mind-blowing considering they have smaller valves than a 302.

Im not sure if its a second channel or part of VGG, but he does do follow ups sometimes of fixing them the rest of the way at his shop after he gets em there. Some he flips, some he junks im sure, but he will get them to safe and tidy them up a bit before he sells them. Not restored by any means, but definitely drivable. I love the novelty of just grabbing something and making it go again, but actually getting it back on the road is awesome.
F100 pt. 2
Riv pt. 2
 
I know most would put a rocket in there or even 454, but i really dig nailheads. Going to keep the 401, hoping to someday find a super-wildcat intake for less than a kidney and firstborn; put a yuuuuuge cam in and sleeper tf outta the thing. Doesnt have the potential of a big block, but will be cool for what it is, and they can make respectable power which is mind-blowing considering they have smaller valves than a 302.

Im not sure if its a second channel or part of VGG, but he does do follow ups sometimes of fixing them the rest of the way at his shop after he gets em there. Some he flips, some he junks im sure, but he will get them to safe and tidy them up a bit before he sells them. Not restored by any means, but definitely drivable. I love the novelty of just grabbing something and making it go again, but actually getting it back on the road is awesome.
F100 pt. 2
Riv pt. 2
Plus one on the nailhead! There sure aren't a bunch of 65 Wildcats running around. You'll win the cool factor with other car guys. Everything doesn't need an LS and a turbo. And nothing sounds like the old engines.
 
True, but running ain't driving. Running means it moves without breaking down, driving means you can use it to drive to work (at least for me) with normal expectations of comfort and functionality (gauges work, heater/air works, no leaks, stereo works if it exists, doesn't smell like wet dog). Some of those Roadkill cars are useless except for beating them unmerciful on a racetrack.

I do also like watching shows like Hand Built Hot Rods (Steve Strope) but those are 2-year projects that are shown at SEMA that only celebrities and CEOs can afford. Still great to see the subtle design mods they do, things that you wish the auto companies would have done. That Nova with the '69 Camaro body lines looked amazing, and stock in badass way.
These two contradict each other a bit, don’t they? I never liked any of those sema show cars because they are literal static art pieces, they’re not driven and who would want to? I’d much rather see a car that was rotting in a field get revived to running, thrashed around and improved upon gradually rather than get blown apart, media blasted and have a crew of 6 tig weld it into a faberge egg SEMA monstrosity on staggered 24/26” wheels with a polished twin turbo LS

As a car nerd a Nova with Camaro body lines is… A Camaro, the hell is the point??? They’re literally the same car under the skin, they may as well build Monte Carlo to look like a Chevelle, or a MN12 Cougar with a Thunderbird like roofline next 😆

VGG deals with rusty cars because unlike most shows that are filmed in Southern California, that’s just how the vast majority of old cars are in the rest of the country, the ones he picks really are mostly rust free relative to others, it’s just something you deal with and can either fix or just live with it, dealing with rotten brake lines and siezed drums is the real reality of it. I think the beauty of that show is that he’s not a snob about what he revives, I couldn’t care less about a white 1970 Cadillac 4 door but the one he revived was kind of the standout episode to me. Other one I recently saw (I think it’s new) was a 86 Grand National barn find, and if not for being a Buick it’s the spitting image of my friends 89 SC, covered in moss, rusty, the worst example of a cool car! Every single thing he did to get it moving we did to that SC, especially including struggling to convert the Teves II ABS system to vacuum. He wasn’t able to finish that car and road-trip it because of it, which some viewers probably found disappointing, but not me, I lived that reality and relived it watching it! 😆
 
I know most would put a rocket in there or even 454, but i really dig nailheads. Going to keep the 401, hoping to someday find a super-wildcat intake for less than a kidney and firstborn; put a yuuuuuge cam in and sleeper tf outta the thing. Doesnt have the potential of a big block, but will be cool for what it is, and they can make respectable power which is mind-blowing considering they have smaller valves than a 302.
Oh, I agree with keeping the nailhead, I just meant in terms of hopping up/updating an older Buick like many car shows would want to do, but they go past the newer Buick design V8s all the way to another LS. I would stop at the 455 (or 430?) and modernize it, fuel injection, electronic ignition, etc. and at least there would be a bit more of a parts selection for those. And it would still be Buick.

These two contradict each other a bit, don’t they? I never liked any of those sema show cars because they are literal static art pieces, they’re not driven and who would want to? I’d much rather see a car that was rotting in a field get revived to running, thrashed around and improved upon gradually rather than get blown apart, media blasted and have a crew of 6 tig weld it into a faberge egg SEMA monstrosity on staggered 24/26” wheels with a polished twin turbo LS
In general, yes, but the Hand Built Hot Rods are more subtle and are made to be driven, though probably not every day where clowns would be banging shopping carts into them. Strope does little changes that really "fix" things that the original needed, like how the dash looks or how body lines meet. This Ford wagon he did is a driver, but an expensive driver, just look at all the cool mods he did to it and yet it looks stock -



But this dude wins SEMA shows a lot, if I remember correctly.

As a car nerd a Nova with Camaro body lines is… A Camaro, the hell is the point??? They’re literally the same car under the skin, they may as well build Monte Carlo to look like a Chevelle, or a MN12 Cougar with a Thunderbird like roofline next 😆
You would think, but not with this idea. Loads of work and it kind of looks "right", or like Chevrolet should have offered as a special model -



VGG deals with rusty cars because unlike most shows that are filmed in Southern California, that’s just how the vast majority of old cars are in the rest of the country, the ones he picks really are mostly rust free relative to others, it’s just something you deal with and can either fix or just live with it, dealing with rotten brake lines and siezed drums is the real reality of it. I think the beauty of that show is that he’s not a snob about what he revives, I couldn’t care less about a white 1970 Cadillac 4 door but the one he revived was kind of the standout episode to me. Other one I recently saw (I think it’s new) was a 86 Grand National barn find, and if not for being a Buick it’s the spitting image of my friends 89 SC, covered in moss, rusty, the worst example of a cool car! Every single thing he did to get it moving we did to that SC, especially including struggling to convert the Teves II ABS system to vacuum. He wasn’t able to finish that car and road-trip it because of it, which some viewers probably found disappointing, but not me, I lived that reality and relived it watching it! 😆
Ya, it is rare to see "failures" on these shows, though Roadkill seems to encourage them, but even though I don't like Cadillacs in general (too luxury/huge) I like the idea of keeping another Cadillac big block alive.
 
Eh, to me the original designers got them right the first time, or in the case of the 57 Ford wagon, the whole thing is too ugly to help 🤐 forward angling the pillar doesn’t make it look even half as good as a stock Chevy Nomad. I don’t mind mixing and matching bolt on parts that are different on a certain year or trim package but once you get into fabricating panels I’m out, cars like that simply don’t do a thing for me, they’re just modern day lead sleds. Rough edges and oddities are part of the personalities of old cars, trying to make them something that they’re not just makes them look like unlicensed video game cars, or concedes to the modern ethos of “hide anything remotely mechanical looking”.

To me the coolest looking 68-72 Nova is one jacked up on air shocks, with their requisite yellow slapper bars clearly visible under the leaf springs, and wearing wide 14” slot mags and polyglas tires, totally stock body. Slammed to the ground on forged wheels and rubber band tires with one off body panels seems like something I’d be paranoid to drive or even do a burnout in, well unless I had $300,000,000 in the bank.😆


Like I said I’ve fallen off roadkill to know how it’s like now, but the only real deliberate/negligent failure I recall being irked by was the 64 Galaxie engine failure(s). They built some hacky stuff like the Rotson but it pretty much just parodies every internet forum fantasy build it’s not supposed to be a spared no expense boring TV show car that they sell to keep the shop running, the results are real, and they just continue push ahead to the next extreme anyway. I still can’t believe they haven’t cracked the 5.0 block with that turbo setup lol
 
Every boosted 5.0 I've seen dies by split block...
 
Id take a 55-57 vicky or variation of, over a comparable chevy. Not that theyre better looking necessarily, but i do like some design elements better. If i went the rest of my life without seeing another 55 chevy it wouldnt bother me in the least. Uncle had a 62 nomad... those are cool. I like the edsels, so im a little different than the majority in terms of taste already.

To me the coolest looking 68-72 Nova is one jacked up on air shocks, with their requisite yellow slapper bars clearly visible under the leaf springs, and wearing wide 14” slot mags and polyglas tires, totally stock body.
Thats how i picture every 2nd gen camaro should look like lol. Also, nova > chevelle > camaro imho.

I agree on the whole though, i cant wait for the "slam everything on 22s" fad to die out so over done and never looked good to begin with (on the old stuff).

I dont pay any mind to sema builds, so many of them are hacked together junk with pretty powder coating and chrome plating.
 
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