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Discussion Starter #1
Whats the best aftermarket Throttle Body to go with?

How big is to big?

What size is best?

What kind of gains am I going to see if any?(I know its no good till i do head work but i dont have the $$$$ for that)

Thanks Guys!
 

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Brian....Why not...

go with a Mustang GT 80mm MAF? You should be able to pick
up a fairly new one from somebody doing an upgrade on a
Mustang site for a good price. You definitely don't need
to go bigger than that. I'm running an 80mm LMAF with my
AED setup and "you know who" has told me twice that until
PI heads and a high flow true dual system enters the
picture - 80mm is plenty big enough. The same goes for your
throttle body. Leave it be for now - when you get to some
more serious breathing mods, then jump to a 70mm TB.

If your chip is a black Diablo (check with Dennis), he
can reflash it for your new MAF - as well as all the other
goodies included in his reburn.

I would consider a looser exhaust system also. Even a
Dynomax catback has some benefit, as you get rid of a
particularly nasty compressed bend after the third cat
and get a set of freer flowing mufflers.

Hope this helps,
 

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I got a 75mm Edelbrock Throttle body, it's a little bigger then your inlet on your intake plenum, and if you want to have all the flow you got to port that plenum to the Throttle body size. but personally I think that a 70mm throttle body would be perfect for most applications.

you'll have a better throttle response and maybe a slight increase in accelaration.
 

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Real Ultimate Goatse Hunter
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281_tuner said:
sorry to bring up this old thread but do you need a reflash for a bigger throttle body and ud pullies?any help would be appreciated thanks


Tom
You 'should' get a retune for it, but its not going to pose any real problems if you don't, at most your idle may be a little off.
 

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Real Ultimate Goatse Hunter
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281_tuner said:
see the thing is im doing a pi swap and theres no telling when im going to get a dyno tune or another reflash,"maybe never lol" so i really dont know what to do i can get a deal on a reflashed eec but i also want the other mods,any suggestions?


Tom
Well do you really need a 75mm throttle body?
 

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:eek: :leftright :2huh: :zdunno: :beek: Holy thread resurrection.. Damn :tongue:
 

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your MAF should see the increased airflow when you switch out the TB, and the O2 sensors will help the engine accomadate for the change. On the other hand, if you are getting PI heads and Porting them I'm not sure if your MAF can handle all that extra airflow. You should definately consider getting a new MAF too.
 

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NRL said:

You 'should' get a retune for it, but its not going to pose any real problems if you don't, at most your idle may be a little off.
the EECs adaptive strategy if he has one of Js chips might be able to read the changes in the engine parameters and adjust accordingly. My chip seemed to have been able to adjust for the changes in my TC when I put in my new trans..A reburn wouldnt hurt though.

joseph
 

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Have to add my 2 cents....

Go ACCUFAB and no need to go more then a 70. You go from 425 cfm to 680 cfm. There have been independant tests and they show that the Accufab has the most power increase for the LONGEST amount of powerband of any of them.

I traded my C&L plenum for the Accufab and never looked back. If you like chrome its the one for you also. I dont care for chrome, but thats what it is.

On a side note I worked directly with Accufab to create the first 97 Plenum. No the mustang plenum will NOT work on the 96 and 97 Birds. They need to have the brake booster vacuum line installed in the back of them.

Not to bring up an old thread, but still very useful information. Got rid of that damn ford racing tb and BBK one that whistled even when it wasnt working. lol
 

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High-Mileage 4.6L Thrasher
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BirdofPrey97 said:
You go from 425 cfm to 680 cfm.
And just how many cfm do you think a stock or even a modified 4.6L can move?
Do the math,then think about it.
I don't like Accufab's deceptive marketing scheme using CFM as a sales tool.
JL
 

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The stock cfm is 425 thats what ford says. C&L moves around 660cfm. These may not be exact numbers been a few months since I looked at it all. They all do cfm ratings.

I had C&L and hated it. I have Accufab and love it. As I said thats just my 2 cents. Read what the 3rd party said here. This is the 2nd of 2 tests. You can check their site for the first test, but the results are the same both times. Accufab wins!!

http://www.modulardepot.com/?show=articlesdet&aid=38

I dont want to argue with anyone, but they do make the best available product.
 

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High-Mileage 4.6L Thrasher
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BirdofPrey97 said:
The stock cfm is 425 thats what ford says. C&L moves around 660cfm. These may not be exact numbers been a few months since I looked at it all. They all do cfm ratings.

I had C&L and hated it. I have Accufab and love it. As I said thats just my 2 cents. Read what the 3rd party said here. This is the 2nd of 2 tests. You can check their site for the first test, but the results are the same both times. Accufab wins!!

http://www.modulardepot.com/?show=articlesdet&aid=38

I dont want to argue with anyone, but they do make the best available product.
That's not what I asked...
How many CFM can the engine consume?..not how much the TB can flow.
Engine analyzer says my new combo will max out CFM at 7700 rpm @633 cfm.
JL
 

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Your engine is consuming 677 cfm??? at what rpm??.... what kind of head/cams/compression are you running??... you must have a forged bottom if you're turning over 7500 rpm..... and I'm guessing about 350rwhp???


Here's another thread on aftermarket TB's... TB Whistle

In it this is one of the things The Man has to say about aftermarket TB's in general:

SCT Guy said:
Whistle is a very interesting problem. It can be caused by seveal things.

The most common is the aftermarket throttle body manufacturers inabiltiy to make a quality part, this is all of them, not just one. A Ford throttle body is made the following way; There is a hole stamped in it for air flow when the blade is closed. Then the blade is closed in the bore and the hard stop is cranked open so that the blade does not stick in the bore. Then, to prevent air leaks a chemical substance called RJ is sprayed on the back of the throttle body blade to seal the blade to the bore. This ensures that the only air flow going into the engine at closed throttle is through that hole and the idle speed valve.

I can assure you that no aftermarket TB manufacturer does this. At one point BBK was spraying an epoxy paint on the back of their throttle bodies, but it flaked off (and was at best a poor solution). The problem is this, to do what I described costs money to set it all up (and RJ is a carcynogentic (I can't spell) compound that requires special handling $$) and do it right. So let's say our Accufab buddies go the extra mile and do all this and make it right. Now their throttle body will cost more than their compeition. So, you as the consumer think, why should I pay more for their throttle body, it's just a throttlebody. So you buy someone elses and they lose business. They have no choice now but to make a sub-Ford standard part to stay in that business. In addition, even if they marketed their throttle body as being better than the other guys, and it would be, can they really charge more money for it, probably not. There will always be some idiot that says his cheap *** TB has no problems. In the mean time he has no clue that his air integrator in his PCM is going nuts trying to control idle, and *****es to his tuner that it doesn't seem to idle right....But, it's just a throttle body.

So, it really comes down to you the consumer being cheap asses and buying stuff that is marginal in quality, so the people that want to do a good job have no choice but to succomb to that level to continue to sell parts. You get what you pay for, a cheap throttlebody is, well, cheap. Its your fault, not theirs.

Now, there are also some other things that can cause whistle, like how the air from the idle speed valve gets introduced into the elbow (it's not a plenum, that's at the bottom of the manifold). The ISC valve flows air at part throttle and the way the air passes through the clean air tube, where the ISC gets it's air from, and the way it's introduced after the valve can have a huge affect on whistle.

From the factory on many cars is an ISC damper, that square black box. This is designed to help some of these issues.

j

There's more...

-mike
 

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Didnt somebody do a pressure test on the TBs to prove this point also? See if I can find it. Hell, could probably do one myself since I have the 70mm in BBK, Accufab, and Ford Racing then theres Mac and since I dont have one of those probably shouldnt do the test since not all aftermarkets will be represented.

Or you can simply take ur TB and fill up our sink with water. Make sure the butterfly is closed and put the intake side face down into the water and test if air and or water come through it provided you dont submurge the entire product.

This however is just a monkeys way of doing a simple test. Also, when is a TB fully closed? Maybe on these -30 days in MN, but I don't drive my Bird in that weather. She is nicely nested up in the garage.

Who has read comsumer reports on these TBs? Would like to know what they say......
 

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BirdofPrey97 said:
Who has read comsumer reports on these TBs? Would like to know what they say......
That's ok, I'll take Jerry's word for it..

Then there's this:

SCT Guy said:
The single biggest problem I see is the throttle body air flow not set right. This problem manifests itself in several ways;

The engine races too much at startup.

When you go to closed throttle the car doesn't slow down like it use to.

The idle could hunt some.

When you push in the cluch on a manual, the engine speed flares up (although there is some of this in a stock car, but that's another post).

I didn't even get into this, but let's say you realize that the airflow is too high so you turn the screw down. Well, without the RJ to seal the blade in the bore, you can probably go all the way down to the point where the blade sticks in the bore. Anyone ever have their TB stick when coming in from closed throttle?

I know of no aftermarket company that sets the airflow when the blade is closed, and can control that airflow to within normal Ford tolerance. I even worked with one once to help them and when the dust settled, they didn't want to take the time to do it, they didn't have a flow bench to create that much vacuum, stuff like that.

Go talk to the '03 Cobra or Lightning guys (my friends :)) with the single blade throttle body and ask them how well idle is controled. It's not, not at all. The shafts are too thin (in an attempt to make them smaller to get more air flow) so the blade actually distorts under vacuum and the closed bore air flow actually changes with time as the blade/shaft take a permanent set. Total nightmare....

If all you have is whistle, you should feel lucky.

j
 
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