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hi everybody.

i currently have a 94 4.6 thunderbird lx. its mostly stock except for i put a cone filter on it and have deleted the mufflers ( although i didnt really mean to do that one :tongue: ).

i've been coming here for awhile and reading the post about engine swaps and i've heard from somewhere that on a 94/95 bird the dohc swap is easier. i was just wondering if this is true because if it is then i was thinking about buying a 93 mark VIII engine block that i found on ebay. i figure if i just buy the block then i can put it together the way i want it (forged internals, etc.)

any help would be appreciated. c-ya
 

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An aluminum PI motor would be best for you. Look for 02+ explorer motors since you have a 94/95 front cover already.

The 4v would require a tune for sure, and the stock torque converter can't rev as high as I would want with a 4v. There is a Catalytic converter on one of the collectors as well, so you would need at least a partially custom exhaust. If you want to use the variable runners, you will need a window switch.
 

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PI swap is slightly less work. On a 96/97, it is a direct swap, but because the 94/95s have the older style intake manifold, you need to convert the top end over to the newer style in order to do a PI swap on the 94/95 cars. This means swapping out fuel lines, intake tube, and re-doing the vacuum lines on top of the engine.

The DOHC swap drops right in, but you need to modify your exhaust, and do a little bit of re-wiring of some sensors.

Both swaps require a tune. Both will cost about the same (DOHC will actually be a little cheaper cause you can get the motors cheaper) for a stock motor. Both swaps will get you pretty close to the same performance level. It really comes down to which you prefer.
 

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PI swap is slightly less work. On a 96/97, it is a direct swap, but because the 94/95s have the older style intake manifold, you need to convert the top end over to the newer style in order to do a PI swap on the 94/95 cars. This means swapping out fuel lines, intake tube, and re-doing the vacuum lines on top of the engine.
And you don't have to redo any of this to put an entirely different archetecture of motor in? It just seems like you're syaing that you DON'T have to redo the vaccum lines and fuel rails for the 4v as well...

The DOHC swap drops right in, but you need to modify your exhaust, and do a little bit of re-wiring of some sensors.

Both swaps require a tune. Both will cost about the same (DOHC will actually be a little cheaper cause you can get the motors cheaper) for a stock motor. Both swaps will get you pretty close to the same performance level. It really comes down to which you prefer.
You can run a PI motor without a tune if you use the stock injectors and MAF.

I completely agree that it really comes down to which you prefer. I've seen both put down 245-255rwhp through a 4r70w. The only difference really is the torque curve.
 

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I wasn't saying you don't have to do that to put a DOHC in, I was just saying why it is more work to do a PI swap on a 94/95 than it is to do a PI swap on a 96/97. Sorry if that wasn't clear.
 

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Hehe, K, Gocha. Just making sure it was clear. Cheers!
 

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Discussion Starter #7
okay so i should be looking for a explorer engine. where is a good place to buy one at. i've already looked at greenleafauto but is there any other good places to buy from. and would it be better to just buy the whole engine do you think it would be cheaper to just buy a block and start from scratch.
and once again thanks for all the help.
 

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Greenleaf is known to be reputable around here....

JustinH has connections if I remember correctly. Might PM Him...

Car-parts.com has a database of salvage yards and what they have.

I'd personally start with a complete longblock. Intake to headers to oil pan, etc. That'll give you the best starting point without having to buy everything and the kitchen sink :) $20 gaskets add up :p
 

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I completely agree that it really comes down to which you prefer. I've seen both put down 245-255rwhp through a 4r70w. The only difference really is the torque curve.
I think the Factory rating of the Mark VIII 4V engine is closer to 290 hp compaired with the 265 of the 2V. Im personally going with the mark engine in my 95 bird. Im also swaping in a rebuilt '02 4R70W which I would recomend you also consider because Most first generation 4R70Ws like ours are on their last legs. The Maurader torque converter is a cheap and effective improvement over your stock coverter for our 2Vs.

I agree with Silenced, you should look for a complete engine. Even if you replace several internal parts you will save money in the end. I've found the prices on Car-parts.com to be a little cheaper than greanleafauto.com

Im also fairly sure both blocks are alluminum so you will save weight with either of your choices.
 

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Bigblockbird I am currently in the process of doing a DOHC swap and I thought it was going to reasonable. Do your home work before you jump in. I agree forged internals and here is some question you need to consider natural aspirated or supercharged what type pistons flat tops or dished what type connecting rods Mahle or Manley H beam or I beam and the connecting rod you pick will also determine the rotating assemblies max RPM. This is just the lower end when it comes to the heads just multiply by 2. Here a link for a complete rotating assembly. http://www.seanhylandmotorsport.com/online/product_info.php?cPath=103_98_26&products_id=49
 

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without question, a dohc is much more work than it seems. There are many unexpected pitfalls and problems to find workarounds for. My PI cam/intake/NPI head porting was much easier. Tho maybe i just prefer engine work to fiddling with little crap where my hands dont reach.
 

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Both have been done numerous times.Both have thier hard ponts.Both make about the same power numbers when swaped N/A and tuned.

The PI 2V can make some impressive numbers for little money(Bolt ons,cams ect.)But a DOHC can make awesome numbers with a Power adder.But it will cost you ethier way to make big power depending on which one you choose.

This topic has been gone over so many times and they are all seperate threads.Search is your friend.
 

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im still 100% convinced that intake manifolds are the key to power on any modular variant.
If I had to guess I would say heads,Cams,intake manifold.Those are key to the Modulars performance.IMHO.
 

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If I had to guess I would say heads,Cams,intake manifold.Those are key to the Modulars performance.IMHO.
Your on the right track. You also have think of exhaust what goes in must come out good flow is the real key.
 

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Exhaust you can get anywhere for a decent price.Knock out the important things first.Making a motor breath is always great.But I would worry more about a Stall,gears,and a Driveshaft first.
 

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Yes your right and if you really want to build a good preformance vehicle you should start from the rear and work back to the engine this was always the way I was taught.
 

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Yes your right and if you really want to build a good preformance vehicle you should start from the rear and work back to the engine this was always the way I was taught.


Start from the rear, and work your way up; works great for cars and women!
 

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im still 100% convinced that intake manifolds are the key to power on any modular variant.
Not really... The PI manifold is good enough in most cases for a 2V head. On a 4V, the intake is an issue, where the 2V head itself is the problem for a SOHC.

Pete
 
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